Memorial Day – Remembering D-Day

With Memorial Day in the United States tomorrow, I have put together a tape of my uncle Edward Thomas’ cousin Leonard Tomaszewski, who will be 98 this summer. I have two sides of audio you can listen to. I decided to put this up a week ahead of D-Day anniverary, Sunday June 6. The audio can be found Leonard Tomaszewski D-Day.

The transcript has been put together by a lady, her first name is Kenna and she lives in the beautiful Canadian province of Alberta.

It is lengthy, but the story was vividly told by my 2nd cousin, Leonard. I asked the questions but mostly listened.

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As recorded by Leonard’s nephew Bob Thomas 2010

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Bob: Yes, that thing about England, you said they blew up all your equipment and stuff?

Leonard: Oh, yes, we lost everything in England and we had to make additions[unclear] parts of England and we left that. But I tell you, Bob, when I looked on the ocean, oh the ships that we had, I thought boy that the Germans will never win that war when we go in there. And there were just hundreds of ships on the water. I don’t know how they ever made it. The water was really rough, Bob. And they said – they sent a ship that goes into – a flagship – between the convoy – they said, “we’re not going to make the invasion June the 5th. We’re going to have to make it on June 6th because the water in the channel is awful rough.” But then it was kind of rough even when we got in there but I’ll tell you, I had two packages out and they rested on my shoulder. I had two parcels out and the machine guns – both were machine guns and my ammo and rifle, I tell you, Bob, I was so sick in that little boat that we were on. I got seasick and I was standing right by the door soon as I fell down. I jumped right in the water [laughs]. It was my fault. I mean, ammunition and everything. I went right over my head, too. But the weight kind of thing got it up little by little and I finally felt the land and I got in. But to get over on the beach we had to go over a high sand dune and it looked like it was about eight foot deep. pretty soon. Two weeks later and we got the equipment and then we got

Bob: What beach did you go to? Utah or Omaha…?

Leonard: Omaha.

Bob: You went to Omaha Beach. Okay.

Leonard: Yeah. We went over a high beach and then we had to come down to get on the land and oh, boy, I tell you, Bob, I didn’t know how I ever got through it but all those guys lying dead around me. They said there were 6000 guys right there before they even made the landing. But I saw those 88 mm shells going all around us and I tell you I says – how in the world did we get into – you know, must be, by God, how did we get through to the [unclear] I got in there, anyway. We got in a little ways and then there was a big tractor pulling one of our machine guns and our cannons, you see, and he went over a mine and blew the big tractor – a tread right off of the tractor. And the guy fell off and the medics were standing right by me. And he looked to help that guy out and before he got there he tripped a trip wire that fired the gun and killed him right on the spot. And then another guy he was on a stretcher, he had a [unclear] right on him. He didn’t know it. What happened I guess he was in such a shock, you know. [unclear]And we had a bunch of [unclear] there and it was pretty hard to get through that. There must have been about five or six times before they go up and back up and back and finally we got to push them back and we finally put them on the run. I think they said it was about 90 – we pushed 90 miles a day and they couldn’t situp nothing because going too fast.

Bob: Ninety miles a day you must have been on trucks, then, right?

Leonard: Yeah, well, I got into Belgium, though. And we had a nice school to sit in and it looked like a modern school. But they made – I was working on the motor pool and they made me take care of 16 officers. I was in a restaurant every day now. So these guys they were – they give me $2.50[laughs] Yes, so – but before I got to Belgium there was a bad – I had to go fix rubber tires on a car or truck, change the oil and everything, and I was walking down towards the village (?) and I was just all by myself and the building was out in a farmer’s field. And all of a sudden I got fired with a day – I think it was only $50 a week – or a month, I mean. I was getting over $100 a month for a few months. That was pretty good money. something fell – full of something - it was a [unclear] shell or 25 caliber or something. Aircraft. And boy, when I woke up, Bob, I was covered with rock and mud and everything all over me. And I didn’t hear that big bomb go off. You think you could hear it whistle or something. I think this was one of those bombs that travels 1500 miles an hour because it’s number 2. The other one was number 1. It only goes 500 miles an hour. But this one went 1500 miles an hour so that’s pretty fast. You could never see it going . It went through so fast. But our boys went up and to look and I’ll tell you Bob, when we went there, that hole in the ground was so deep you could have buried, I think, about three houses. That’s why I got covered up with all that mud and everything. And I thought I was shot but it was from the aircraft – I had my hands oh, my God, oh, I tell you, Bob, that scared the life out of me. By that time I thought we lost two men anyway, during that raid, and we lost all of our equipment again another time so we were without equipment for a while again. But we went to a school there for awhile and then we went to Germany. And I wound up in – I don’t know what part of Germany but they called it the Hartz mountains over there in Germany.

Bob: The highest mountain?

Leonard: Yeah, Hartz, H-A-R – something like that. Hartz Mountain. And we were living in a school there and that school was a nice school. And they had – all the young women were making babies for Germany so they got prepared for another big one. Isn’t that something? Oh, Bob, I’ll tell. Did I mention the city?

Bob: The city of – Hartz Mountains, Germany?

Leonard: I’ve forgotten. Anyway, I was in that school over there. Making sure the officers – and my colonel, he called me, he said, “Hey, come over here,” and I said, “yes, sir?” He said, you see that young couple standing over there? And he wants all that food that’s left over from the kitchen and here’s my chicken. And he said, you give it to that young couple. All the boys they went to the restaurant on Sundays and didn’t bother to eat in camp, you know, so there was a lot of food left over. And my chaplain and I we went to – we were helping to feed the whole village up there. Yeah, you could have one child, maybe a few chickens. And I went through a lot of stuff in that darned war. But it wasn’t all a picnic. But there was some good out of it, too.

Bob: I’m looking at a map. You were in the US First Army, right?

Leonard: I was in basic training for seven to eight weeks. And then we were in England. When we left from Boston to Liverpool we lived in England all winter long and then in June we made that invasion.

Bob: So you’d just been in the army a short time when it happened?

Leonard: Well, we were quite a while lived there in England. But we didn’t do nothing. But in the end we were going to go on maneuvers. And that was close to where we were going to make the invasion already. So we got all set up went to bed and all of a sudden bombs were falling all around us and one of them fell so close to me it took me right out of the bed and lifted and put me right on the floor. [laughs]

Bob: When was that? That was in England?

Leonard: Yes, in England. And went there – everybody thought it was going to hit but if it was going to hit my house I was going to jump out of the two story building but I seen he leveled off and the boys got him. And next thing in the morning, Bob, when we got up, there was over 500 of them landed in the Channel. And we didn’t even make the invasion yet.

Bob: That was 500 men on the English channel?

Leonard: And then going through Germany it was no picnic. I was in Germany – they blew up a lot of the ammunition dumps and there’s nothing that you can hide when they blow that ammunition. There’s shells flying in every direction. We were just fortunate we didn’t get hit. I seen some fellows that pushed on bombs with a bulldozer and one was shocked – he was just shocked to see – he was just – what would you call it? He was in shock and he didn’t know what he was doing. So then – it would take me a long time to tell you.

Bob: Like I say, it really is – it’s interesting. And I know it was awful. Awful.

Leonard: How’s your dad doing now?

Bob: He’s hanging in there. He’s lost some weight and then his throat’s sore – he’s going to the doctor…

Leonard: He’s coming up to 70 years old?

Bob: He’s 91.

Leonard: He’s 90? My wife is 92 this – on February 28th.

Bob: He’ll be 92 in March.

Leonard: I’ll be 98 in August. As far as I’m concerned I feel pretty good except for my lousy hip right where it bends close to my belt there. And I got a little four wheeled cart there that I have to use to go around the house and outside where I go. Yeah.

Bob: The cables and stuff like that – I had read – you know, I’m doing this research on World War II and stuff and when you said this stuff would be great for the D-Day story and I knew Eddy was in D-Day. I’ve gotten a letter. Eddy wrote a letter on D-Day I found in his office. I mean, Eddy was a regular keeper. I have hundreds of his letters and stuff of the war and he saved every little document he had, which I put on his website. And if you had a computer to look at it, you’d just be amazed at some of those – I’ve 120 pages up there. I’m thinking like a book or something. I’ve been working on it probably been about a year now. Every day doing a little bit if I can and some days do more and other days – you know. But they buried pipe in the English channel that – I don’t know if it transferred oil or something? I guess that’s what it was. A pipeline.

Leonard: Well, pipelines are down in Alaska there.

Bob: This was a pipeline in the English channel for the – that’s what I just read about and there’s actually a film on it. But the only place to see it is Belgium or something. I don’t know where it was. It was some country there, you can go view this film. I don’t know if you can see it around here. And it was a secret – I guess it was a secret project. I thought they were talking like electrical ones but it sounded like it was an actual tube that they could push oil through from across the English channel.

Leonard: They got a bridge under there now.

Bob: Yes, I guess it was a way they supplied you guys with fuel. Oil and I don’t know…

Leonard: I know one time when I was in England – you know, you had to watch yourself when you walk out in the street. The women would go after you and so help me they wanted a date with you.

Bob: Didn’t they have things where you couldn’t date the Germans or something like that? You could get in trouble for going out with…

Leonard: I didn’t know about that. Well, I was married. Our oldest daughter was a month old when I went to service and you know, Bob, I just built a brand new house for her on Helen Street in Detroit and my dad – her dad and I built a garage and all I had to do was put a floor in the garage and I didn’t finish the floor. I got that letter from the government; you’re called to go into the service. Oh, God, Bob, my heart just went right under – ohh, and my wife got so hysterical that I was going. We had to keep her quiet because I [unclear] a 7-month-old girl. So yeah, and when I went over that – [unclear] I got over that channel and I got my parcel and a letter because I promised to write her a letter every day. And I did. I just bought a brand new Hudson. It was the most beautiful car I ever had. And I just built a brand new house, Bob, and it was the most beautiful house I ever had. I built that house for her and then I said, “Don’t sell that house and don’t sell the car”. And she figured I guess I wasn’t going to come back. And her father even bawled her out. “Why are you selling everything? He’s going to come back and what is he going to have?” And you know, she sold it anyway and then but the Fire Department has some kind of a prize that they give a car once a year. And oh, Bob, when that car – I don’t know what they called it – a Brocham (sp?) it was a car that had two seats but it had a long trunk where you could put a lot of stuff in the trunk. And that was a heartbreak. I bought that in 1940, I guess. But yeah, she sold it. And when I come home I didn’t have nothing again! I had to start all over from scratch.

Bob: This was – wow, that was something else.

Leonard: Oh boy, I’ll tell you Bob, it took the bottom of my heart right out. My wife just would not listen to me. And I thought maybe she did – I sent all my money to her but you know, Bob, when I was getting $250 a month from the officers, I was getting – for four or five months I was getting close to $100 and I said, “Did you get all the money I sent you? The $100 bills?” “No”, I got a feeling she must have lied to me. She was pretty good at that, you know. When I looked at her life and my life she should have been a career woman. She didn’t even want the second child when I come home. I thought, well, it would be nice to have another child, company for our older daughter. And she didn’t like that a bit as well. She [unclear couple of sentences] You know what? There’s a lot of things I could tell you, Bob, but it would be a bad story.

Bob: Your record over there in World War II is really commendable.

Leonard: And then, we’re going to be 80 and we did, we already passed 81 – 71 years, Bob of married life.

Bob: Wow. That’s something.

Leonard: Not many go through that.

Bob: No, that’s for sure. Seventy-one years.

Leonard: For the last few years my wife survived I couldn’t go to church services. I couldn’t go no place without her. But she get out of her room, I wouldn’t know what she would do. It was that bad already. No, the older daughter – working at a hospital and then there’s a nursing home and then there’s another building added to it and it’s only for people who – because they lose their minds.

Bob: You mean like Alzheimer’s?

Leonard: They can’t do nothing in their life no more. And they built a brand new – I guess it’s a while ago, and they got 300 people and they got to build that thing bigger yet. There’s so many people like that. See my wife there every now and then and so many people other things they can’t even sit up to eat.

Bob: I worked in a nursing home when I was in college years ago. And they had three levels of care. The people on the ground floor were the ones that were bedridden and really – you couldn’t even talk to them but ahh, the ones on the third and second floor were usually – most of the…

END OF FIRST RECORDING

TRANSCRIPTIONIST’S NOTE – THERE IS A GREAT DEAL OF BACKGROUND NOISE ON THIS SECOND TAPE, MAKING TRANSCRIPTION CHALLENGING

Leonard: …the Battle of the Bulge.

Bob: Battle of the Bulge.

Leonard: I had a video on that. I tell you, what those boys went through. And they were all in their summer clothes. And the Germans all dressed up in their winter clothes and they really they killed quite a few 1000s of our boys but they couldn’t come in their aircraft because of their weather and they when they did come in it was – the Germans it was that quick. They got rid of them all at once.

Bob: Now you weren’t involved with the Battle of the Bulge, were you?

Leonard: They had me sitting on a – we were at [unclear] or I was and they said, “you better stay outside or you might have to go down to…” so they must have known about that already. And we stayed outside the village and we didn’t have to go to the Battle of the Bulge. And then finally we waiting half a day were waiting outside and they said, “No, you won’t have to go. You can just go home.” And that was kind of a good thing for me because boy, I probably wouldn’t be home, either.

Bob: Yeah, the Battle of the Bulge – that was – I’m trying to think…

Leonard: Another big group of soldiers was assembling because they couldn’t handle it with those Germans the way they were going.

Bob: You’d already had been at D-Day.

Leonard: Going home already. I was in a country – in Germany called Hartz Mountains up there. Do you know where that is?

Bob: I don’t know where it is or anything but I was just looking at a map.

Leonard: We went home. We went down to the northern part of France and got on the boat and took us 10 days to get home even.

Bob: Ten days to get home on the boat, huh?

Leonard: Ten days to get home because we had to shut off all the motors when we were going across the ocean so they wouldn’t know where we were at so we had to shut all our motors. We just everybody sit and just quiet and then in the morning we’d start all calm.

Bob: When did you…

Leonard: I was living in England at that time. And the German submarines were around us. These days they call them I call them a wolf pack there were so many submarines out in that area. But you know what? Do you remember Lindbergh?

Bob: Yes, and I’ve got a…

Leonard: And they crossed the ocean. When he came back he said the Germans are building a lot of submarines. And this country took it pretty light. He said, I’m nervous. And I’ll tell you one of the finest men in England. Churchill.

Bob: I think so.

Leonard: You know, he knows what they did in the First World War. And they went to Austria already and he says, you’d better get there and stop them right now. “We don’t want to hurt them. Let them do what they want.” You know, we were all down in Africa. And the boys on the [unclear] when I joined them, they made – they landed in Africa, Italy, Sicily and I told you…

Bob: Normandy or…

Leonard: Normandy Beach, yes. Well, there were quite a few of them. They were pretty scared. We were just new people. We didn’t know what that was like. But I tell you all those soldiers that coming down I didn’t think none of us would come out alive. We were walking over dead bodies and some of those guys they never even made it to shore there. You know the Germans had wooden props in the water so when the boats come in they got stuck. And some guys got hung up there and they died right there, too. So I tell you awful sight. All the men died around me. And we were the second wave already.

Bob: You were the second wave, yes.

Leonard: Yeah. And I remember just before dark they had those – I forget what they call them – and they only carry 18 people, 18 passengers at one time, and they pulled a glider behind, too. And those gliders are going five miles behind the German lines. They were making a landing over there. And you know what they had, Bob? When got close to a telephone post every so many feet, when the glider came in, the cut them posts right down to the ground. And when I went there all I could see was those broken up gliders, all smashed glider with – oh, boy, five miles behind those lines. Yeah, so there was quite a bit of bad stuff, too. Those Germans were well prepared. They had already made. They had two pillboxes there, I’d say about 200 feet apart and they had underground tunnels one to another and the two pillboxes were four foot thick, Bob. They fired shells on them and all they did was chip it up where the concrete was. They never could break that pillbox apart. Those Germans were well prepared. But I’ll tell you one thing, they’re good fighters, Bob.

Bob: They were good fighters. And I guess Eisenhower really…

Leonard: Oh, he’s the one made the decision to make that invasion. We should not ever have made it but I think they were watching that weather pattern so much that I guess that channel is not quieting down at all. We went in there but it was rough, though. I know when I dropped in the water with all that ammunition I went over my head. [laughs] I had a belt filled with air but it didn’t help very much because I had too much weight. And I carried the bullets along to where we were going to use it. [laughs]

Bob: You knew how to swim, though, didn’t you?

Leonard: Well, dog paddle.

Bob: I mean, you were weighted down with a hundred pounds of…

Leonard: Well, the weight kind of going up and down and I could feel the ground. It seemed like it was taking me to shore and finally I made it and I just walked out. And the fellow – he drove a jeep a piece out of that boat I come off of and the water turned him off and went right back in the boat. He was in the water up to his neck. Poor guy. But he got it straightened out. One thing they said is waterproof those cars so they can go in the water pretty deep. But they got to put them wherever the air goes into the boat or the car or whatever it is, they got that all tight up and they can go deep in the water.

Bob: What’s this that goes deep in the water?

Leonard: The jeeps in the truck. I don’t think – the Duck.

Bob: The Ducks, right? Those are made in Pontiac, Michigan and they have them…

Leonard: I don’t know, Bob.

Bob: Linda and I went to the Wisconsin Dells. They give you tours in those boats. They have…

Leonard: I was in them…

Bob: They – I mean, it’s neat. They stop at the edge of the water and they just change the transmission and your truck is now a boat.

Leonard: You know, we drifted on the beach for a while, Bob, the water would go away from the shore for a mile or more. That tide would – all the way out.

Bob: Yes, they said you guys, when you landed you didn’t land right where you were supposed to. You drifted.

Leonard: But you know, those cargo ships when they came in, they came in with the tide and then they’d shut the boat and then when the water went out of there and the tugboats come in there they’d take one load at a time. Tugboats. It’s kind of interesting to go in the water like that, too, but I didn’t see any of those. The thing about them jeeps, you know, if you rode with the top down those Germans had piano wires stuck across the road from one end to the other and when you went past that it would cut your head right off.

Bob: Oh, my goodness.

Leonard: Yeah, they had that done, too. But you never know when you go across that wire, though. And then one day I was in [unclear] England[unclear] I got the nerve decided that [loud background noise - unclear] before she [unclear]. That was wrong. Because I know she was after – in the meantime, I went on a street in England and one of our boys was driving a truck, hit a soldier walking on the road and knocked him on the road and thought it killed him. So he come back and then he took off. I went to the Civilian center and said, could you get some help for me. This boy’s been hit by a truck. She said, “We don’t have no gasoline.” I thought oh, boy, then another truck came by and I stopped and we picked him up and took him to where I lived but he was okay. there and a young lady goes by me and she was

Bob: You were pretty much on your own when you landed there, too, for a while, weren’t you on the beach? You pretty much just had to keep going, moving inland without officers leading you? Or did you have all your officers with you?

Leonard: Oh, yes, the officer was with us. We were ahead of him, though. [laughs] Instead of him being ahead of us we were ahead of him. He was standing around one of the pillboxes. No, we just went right in. And we got settled down, there, because I don’t know how in the world they ever got so many prisoners here. I’m looking, they got a bunch of German prisoners. And I thought, wow, what – they were firing at – from Sherbrooke(?), it was about 30 some miles and they were firing all those shells from pretty much [unclear] but the truck didn’t get here. It was very hard. I couldn’t name all the countries that were in. I know England. It was a small country. I can’t remember the name.

Bob: I’m looking at a map. I was trying to think. You said Belgium and you were in Germany…

Leonard. Yes, before we hit Belgium I forgot what kind of country we went through.

Bob: I would say there’s…

Leonard: We went through quite a bit of France, too.

Bob: France and Belgium.

Leonard: And there was a small country like France there.

Bob: It’s not Switzerland, is it?

Leonard: No. Not that far. A small country and I think you can almost walk across that country in one day.

Bob: Wow. You got me curious.

Leonard: I can’t remember that day but anyway we were into that and then you looked for a long ways and France before Germany and we had a lot of rainy weather the day before. You talk about mud, ohh, our trucks couldn’t even move anywhere, driving around all over the ground there and they said – the officer said, “Don’t buy anything, food from the farmer because what they eat if you eat you might not survive.” The boys got fed up with so we got some meats from farmers. They put a dynamite stick in the water and all the fish were floating up in the water so we had fish. [laughs] We made our own meal. [laughs]. Ahh, I tell you one thing, Bob, you know, I prayed there day after day after day that the Lord would bring me back home. You know something, Bob? Out of the whole company I was in, I think it was only six or seven that never went home. The rest of them all went home. That’s how many people went home. Six hundred from my company.

Bob: You had how many people there?

Leonard: Only seven lost out of the whole company.

Bob: Seven left?

Leonard: Four of them were lost in England and about three or so in Germany. So we done pretty good. And seven people out of the whole unit without…

Bob: You mean the rest had all died?

Leonard: Most of us went home rich. About seven of them never made it to go home.

Bob: So you didn’t have as many casualties in your group? Is that country – not Luxembourg, is it?

Leonard: No.

Bob: I’m trying to look at a map here.

Leonard: No, I can’t remember. I can’t

Bob: You had how many people there?

Bob: Seven left?

Bob: You mean the rest had all died?

Bob: So you didn’t have as many casualties in your group? Is that country – not Luxembourg, is it?

Bob: I’m trying to look at a map here.

Leonard: No, I can’t remember. I can

remember but France and Belgium were kind of the…

Bob: Oh, France and Belgium, yes. I was trying to think of a country over there. I remember that in geography. Yes, I’m looking at France and then BelgiumWest Germany. and then you must have gone into

Leonard: We were in Belgium for quite a while.

Bob: And then Netherlands north of that but that’s another…

Leonard: I think that’s probably France and Germany. But there was a little bitty country kind of west of France. And it’s a small country, too. You could drive through it and not even know it.

Bob: I’m trying to see it. And I’m not seeing it but this atlas is…

Leonard: Do you have a map there?

Bob: I do have a map. I’m looking at an atlas right now but…

Leonard: It’s only a small country. About a four letter word, I think.

Bob: Four letter word? Gosh – yeah, looking – there’s the United Kingdom and I’ve gone back over to France and I see all the countries…

Leonard: That would be great. Would be like Rhode Island.

Bob: Yes, like Rhode Island and I’m trying to say the Netherlands but you weren’t in the Netherlands or Switzerland. This is a part of Germany.

Leonard: That was west of France. It should be up there in the little – west of France.

Bob: West of France? Let me find France again on here. Here’s France. Oh, you know what? There’s – wow – there’s a – that’s a province or I don’t know what it is, but I was thinking of Finnes (sp) there but I think that’s part of France. When you landed in Normandy and the English channel then Belgium – oh, you know, Belgium‘s right next to it. Past – Calesa (?)? No, that’s a – but you know, then there’s Martone (?), no, these are all little provinces.

Leonard: Very small country.

Bob: Luxembourg. You said no.

Leonard: Luxembourg. I think that’s what it is.

Bob: It might be Luxembourg. Okay, yeah, you come up to Luxembourg it’s capital is a town called…

Leonard: We were there, too, during the war.

Bob: There’s a town called Longway in France – no, but – Luxembourg is very small.

Leonard: Yes.

Bob: It’s right in between Germany and Belgium.

Leonard. Yes.

Bob: Cool. I see on a map there it’s small as a – it’s – and Luxembourg and then the capital’s spelled the same way.

Leonard: I tell you, Bob, when we were in that country…

Bob: Belgium?

Leonard: Belgium, yes, we went there and they were sending aircraft going to London, loading up and going to – and a regular circle all day long all day long and they really bombarded that German people.

Bob: That’s what I hear D-Day started Germany – started going after different cities in Germany.

Leonard: You know, talk about friendly fire, Bob, you know, they killed a lot of our friends that we didn’t need to and they didn’t say nothing about it. There’s a mistake that can be made. You don’t get organized in the aircraft and your signal and you can make a mess out of it, I would think. Some of the boys got in a 25 mile line and some of the boys never made it.

Bob: What’s a 25 mile line?

Leonard: You know, what is it but they did that in the Hundred Year War and with the Saddam Hussein when they declared war. Do you remember that war?

Bob: Which one?

Leonard: With the Saddam Hussein

Bob: That was like 1990…

Leonard: Yeah, it was the 100 Day and then when they were retreating, do you remember, all those oil wells on fire and nobody there could put it out so they had to get them in from the United States. They’re the ones that knew how to do it.

Bob: Yes, it’s a messy job.

Leonard: That fire that – you got to push the air down and then you can put a cap on it right away. And they got it done in a few days.

Bob: How long?

Leonard: They were gone a few days. Put that awful thing out.

Bob: I remember that was going to be an environmental mess.

Leonard: I think got it done pretty good. Well, all the oil wells up there. That’s when he put them all out. You know, Hussein, I don’t know if he’s still alive.

Bob: No, they hung him. I can’t remember the year exactly but it was four or five years ago now. I think maybe about four years ago.

Leonard: But do you know something, Bob? This war that we’re fighting now, I don’t think it’s a no win battle. They can’t win this war.

Bob: Which one? The Iran?

Leonard: Afghan. You know, they don’t care if they commit suicide but they blow up buildings and everything with them. And I know exactly – check on vehicles or not? They can’t find them people. Every day there’s someone blown up. I can’t figure this going to be a no win war. It’ll be like in that country we fought…

Bob: Vietnam?

Leonard: Vietnam. Same thing. We didn’t win that war either. And yet when the boys came back the people didn’t like them. Because I guess some of our boys were ordered to shoot some of those villagers on there too, because a war is one of the worst things ever. But I’m afraid now is the United States has got the most powerful bombs in about three different countries around the world but I’m afraid that everything’s going to go now that Germany…